User talk:Sorceror Nobody/Archive2

Cascade on Acts template
I'd almost forgotten about this. I want to take Cascade off the acts template, for the mindblowingly simple reason that it is not an act. It was a big enough event, and Hussie put a big link to it in the map, but that does not make it an act. And the template is there to link us to the different pages for each act, sub-act, sub-sub-act (hussie pls), and intermission in Homestuck. If you want to put Cascade there, then why not put links to every little map icon on the Homestuck map? I mean, they're on the map, they must surely be put on here too!

tldr mspa homestuck map page =/= mspawiki homestuck acts template

also I'll be fiddling around with the color for a6a5a2, do not be alarmed, I won't take cascade out until your say so NikLink (talk) 03:32, January 12, 2013 (UTC)


 * Suggestion: All Act colors should be of analagous stripes on their respective curtains. Aepokk Venset 04:59, January 12, 2013 (UTC)


 * Equating the small link icons to the large banner icons is pretty feeble. You may also care to consider another point – Cascade has an article to itself. No other single 'normal' Flash page that isn't a whole act or intermission has that (walkarounds are different matters because of the level of interactivity). And if you don't like going by the map page, then going by the wiki for a template on the wiki seems a decent idea to me


 * Alright, let's go by wiki logic.


 * Templates give organized links to all articles that fit a certain category.
 * 'Homestuck Acts' is a template.
 * ∴ 'Homestuck Acts' is for Acts of Homestuck.


 * 'Homestuck Acts' is for Acts of Homestuck.
 * 'Cascade' is not an Act of Homestuck.
 * ∴ 'Cascade' should not appear in 'Homestuck Acts'.
 * NikLink (talk) 06:05, January 14, 2013 (UTC)


 * I guess I should add my thoughts on this? I agree with SN on the icons/banners point, equating the small icons to the large banners is disingenuous. Also I agree with NikLink that the "wiki logic" arguement isn't particularly strong. That being said, Hussie clearly didn't intend to imply it is an act, but rather that its importance is such that it is worth displaying it alongside acts. So that could make the issue one of purist vs. non-purist; list only acts or follow Hussie and list a non-act with the acts. That being said, a wiki's purpose is to distribute information. So the question really should be; does listing Cascade help or harm this objective? I think there are points for both sides but without going into the points, my personal opinion is that it is more helpful than not.
 * On a really pretentious/academic angle, while the ending of all the acts are known as EoA (end of acts), however Cascade is the only one to actually call itself this. From this view-point it could almost be viewed as a micro-act. A micro-act wouldn't really be an act at all (even sub-sub-acts are still acts) but be worthy of listing among them. I am mentioning this because I think part of the issue is that Cascade is being displayed as though it were a sub-act, perhaps if a compromise were to be reached on how exactly it was displayed? For example:
 * Current display: Act 5 (A5A1, A5A2, EoA5)
 * Hypothetical display: Act 5 (A5A1, A5A2 (EoA5) )
 * Anyhow if you want my stripped-down/core opinion: I think displaying Cascade on the template isn't of high importance, however I don't think there is much reason to remove it either. - The Light6 (talk) 08:46, January 14, 2013 (UTC)


 * "'Homestuck Acts' is for Acts of Homestuck."
 * Are the intermissions acts? By strict name definition, no. What the template is called is an even weaker wiki argument than the one I made. Because if you're going to be that picky, we should rename the template to "Navbox Homestuck Acts, Sub Acts, Sub Sub Acts, Intermissions and Sub Intermissions (and Cascade)". Or alternatively, you could stop acting like the name completely defines it
 * EDIT: Actually I feel this is a point I should make as clear as possible.
 * Templates give organized links to all articles that fit a certain category.
 * No, they don't. Templates do whatever they are designed to do. My signature is a template. Template:Warning1 is a template. Okay, so you meant navigation templates, right? Well, they aren't like that either. They give organised links to whatever we decide they link to. We choose for the links in Navbox HS Acts to the the acts, intermissions, etc, because that's a sensible thing for it to do. But if we wanted to, we could make a "navigation" template that had ten links to utterly random pages on the wiki. The wiki is not intrinsically bound to obey any layout of MSPA. And the templates do what we build them to do
 * The problem sounds like a naming issue, why not rename "Homestuck Acts" to something else that would include Cascade? 16:10, January 14, 2013 (UTC)


 * Well I apologize. I didn't mean 'templates'. I meant 'box thingies that go at the end of articles of a certain categories that contain the other articles of that category in a neatly listed matter for your browsing enjoyment'. You know what I mean.
 * I like TheLight6's edit of the boxey thingy, by the way. Although I would have preferred seeing it off the navigation rectangle altogether, I'm willing to accept it as a compromise. NikLink (talk) 04:36, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

Remove add photo button from galleries
Given part of the problem of people adding more images than is needed (and not being redirected to the Upload page) is the "add photo to gallery" button. However we can remove that button wiki wide by adding some code to the css if we want, so just gonna run it by you. .wikia-gallery-add { display: none !important; } I mean we can also do it by adding hideaddbutton="true" to every gallery, but that is just too much unneeded work, though it might be good practice to do it anyhow, as I've heard reports of that particular css script not working on some browsers for some reason, even though that doesn't make sense, though considering our recent situations I am not surprised. - The Light6 (talk) 13:30, February 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Done. Didn't even hesitate :P And yeah, it may be worth adding the safeguard. It's not going to be too bad, I shouldn't think – we don't have that many galleries. They're mainly on character and walkaround pages

pre/post-Scratch
I thought we agreed a while ago that the Scratch was a proper noun because it's referencing a specific event, not just a scratch. I think Scratch should be capitalised, but I am open to a discussion. Eitherway we should add the result to the manual of style, if it doesn't include that already.

Also, on an unrelated note. What's inherently wrong about galleries at the start of a page? I think the group pages such as kids and trolls and exiles etc look perfectly fine with that initial gallery, and it makes for easier navigation. bitterLime 18:01, February 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * The only person who consistently capitalises The Scratch is, surprise surprise, someone who is predictably smug about assigning gravitas to the word. To the extent that he also capitalises "The". Of characters who use correct capitalisation in their quirks,
 * HS 4876 (Vriska doesn't capitalise it)
 * Rose HS 5527 (doesn't capitalise it initially,) capitalises "Scratch" (but not "The") only HS 5529 (during) HS 5530 (the) HS 5538 (span) while she's talking to – which is a matter of following his lead, especially as Rose has HS 3490 (imitated quirks before) – and then HS 6603 (reverts to) HS 6606 (not capitalising it.)
 * HS 5953 (When talking about the ancestors,) neglects to capitalise both "scratched" as a verb and "the scratch" as a noun.
 * HS 6677 (Aranea) HS 6677 (also) HS 6826 (does) HS 6902 (not) HS 6903 (capitalise) HS 6907 (it.) There are probably some Aranea examples in Openbound, too. EDIT: See below.
 * The narrative doesn't capitalise it HS 7010 (here.)
 * EDIT: Checked Openbound. Part one has three uncapitalised instances each for Kankri and Porrim, while part three has one uncapitalised instance from Horuss and two from Aranea that are, unusually for her, both capitalised.
 * The biggest indicator, though, is that HS 5138 (Recap 3) has four instances, none of which are capitalised. We may query the canonicity of capitalisations used on Hussie's tumblr etc. but the recap is in-comic, so it's a very strong case. Speaking of recap 3, here's pretty much everything from that page that might be open for debate on capitalisation. Most won't need debating; others might warrant discussion.
 * {|border=1 cellpadding=2 cellspacing=0 width=660px


 * first guardian
 * Green Sun*
 * the Tumor
 * the veil
 * the Furthest Ring
 * dream self
 * horrorterrors
 * boonbonds
 * bro
 * the battlefield
 * the reckoning
 * nanna
 * paradox space
 * the Windy Thing
 * the* Breeze
 * Quest Bed*
 * The Felt
 * grandpa
 * god tier
 * (his) dad
 * (Rose's) mom
 * LOHAC Stock Exchange
 * consorts
 * scourge sisters
 * fraymotifs
 * echeladder
 * CRITICAL MOMENT
 * colspan=3|every piece of Sburb equipment (alchemiter etc.)
 * grist
 * dream bubbles
 * the medium
 * incipisphere
 * the scratch*
 * }
 * tl;dr: Overwhelming majority of evidence is against capitalising the scratch.
 * dream bubbles
 * the medium
 * incipisphere
 * the scratch*
 * }
 * tl;dr: Overwhelming majority of evidence is against capitalising the scratch.


 * As for galleries, it's just kind of a thing that galleries belong at the bottom of pages. It's not exactly a strict rule, it just generally looks better. Also remember that the MoS advises avoidance of galleries where possible, and pretty much all of the top-of-page galleries fall into the category of "not really needed". But maybe that's just me


 * Regarding "the medium" as opposed to "the Medium": this is a kind of a weird case where Hussie isn't consistent and goes back and forth. Recaps 2 and 3 use "medium" exclusively, but the first recap and actual in-comic narration - including, most recently, Hussie talking to Caliborn - consistently use "Medium". Given that the capitalized version is used more frequently, I think we should use that. 20:41, February 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * I've now started a thread for this whole issue here. Feel free to begin working on entries for other terms from the table above, imitating how I've set the table up for "scratch"

RE: Noirglish
I pulled it off Imgur, though really anyone could have made the edit. I don't think it's necessarily a fan edit in that it changes the content of the image, it's just adjusting the original picture to fit in a certain format, it's no different from having certain pictures edited to have a transparent background. I think it belongs. Just my two cents! Rabbeseking (talk) 09:10, February 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * Just because I feel like being technical, adding in parts of the image that weren't initially there is in fact different from removing parts to make it transparent, in my opinion. Which image we use is up to SN though, I don't really have much of an opinion. Aepokk Venset 18:37, February 10, 2013 (UTC)
 * ^that's pretty much the point, yeah. The image, if it's not from Hussie himself, is being filled in by non-canon material, even if it's only filling gaps and is likely only a few pixel clusters wrong. On balance, it's probably not worth worrying about that much, so I guess the image can stay. I'll just stick a note on the file page

I suppose they did have to add in things here, but I think it's an incredibly minor thing. The picture pretty much completely maintains it's original image minus the formatting. 70.117.242.87 20:19, February 10, 2013 (UTC)

Page needs to be deleted
I'm fairly sure this page needs to be deleted, and does not belong on the Wiki. Rabbeseking (talk) 02:42, February 17, 2013 (UTC)

RE: Border/thumb
I don't think that looks all that great, but alright! I'll adhere by MoS. Rabbeseking (talk) 15:35, February 17, 2013 (UTC)

FlaxenShibboleth
Is it really a safe move to just give him a temporary block? I feel like he'll just do the same thing again the second the block expires. Aepokk Venset 15:06, February 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * We should never issue a permanent block first time, just on principle.
 * But I was tempted. So tempted

Aranea's Page
Apologies for the uh.. "Uuuugh horrible violations" of the MoS. I generally don't add to biography sections, but I thought I would, since nobody had updated it. Now I know. Rabbeseking (talk) 00:04, February 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * I looked at your edit and I don't think he was talking to you, you only added a bit whereas he modified the entire page afterwards. Regardless, I wouldn't worry about it. Aepokk Venset 04:13, February 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, although the edit you did make was counter to MoS, you were only imitating the rest of the page being written in past tense, so my groan was directed at the whole page, not at you specifically. Obviously, Aranea's page is far from the only one like that (I expect the other A1 trolls at least are much the same), but you drew my attention to that page :P

Regex
Just in case the "general fixes" option doesn't do the trick, I think you should be able to use this regex for a "find and replace":
 * Find (with "Regex" and possibly "Singleline" checked): \[\[Category:([^\]]+)\]\](.*)\[\[Category:\1\]\]
 * Replace with: $2

I haven't tested either this (or the general fixes option), so it might need tweaking. Anyway, I hope one or the other does the trick. -- 17:11, February 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * *gives the regexp a quick glance so he can see generally what it's doing without getting stuck in the details*
 * ...actually yeah that looks about right. We can give it a try if necessary

Calliope/Caliborn gif
Thank you so much for fixing it! The misalignment has been bothering me for a while. Aepokk Venset 00:51, March 14, 2013 (UTC)

Hiatus length
So just checking, Also, for me the RSS does show seconds. Aepokk Venset 02:12, June 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * a) Wouldn't the right number be Hussie's timezone, e.g. 03:19?
 * b) I hope you subtracted the time using the last page of the last update and the first page of this one.
 * Since I know what kind of time the update happened last night, I can see that my assumption that the RSS is UTC (at least when I'm looking at it if nothing else) was correct. But it's ultimately irrelevant now since whatever timezone the RSS is on, it's the same for both timestamps, and so the duration is correct. As for the seconds, yeah, I just looked in the page source of the RSS (I don't know how you have it displaying them directly), so I'll add that.
 * And of course I subtracted using those pages. What kind of prat do you take me for? :P
 * I have it displaying correctly cause for some dumb reason the source code is my default view of it, and I can't change it. May be a Chrome thing idk. Anyway reading over that brought up a question in my mind I'm sure nobody wants to talk about: when does the update "happen"? Is it when he adds the first page, and is it accessible immediately? Or does he add each to the site and then add the page link, in which case the "update" happens when the last page is added, or a little after? It also makes me wonder how exactly MSPANotify works. Aepokk Venset 22:47, June 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * I would say the update happens when it becomes available. MSPA Notifier works by checking if new pages are available or not, so it won't say there is an update until it happens. Meanwhile MSPA Prophet goes deeper and checks if Hussie has uploaded anything and how much and then tells people that there will be an upcoming update of a certain size, but not that the update is there or when it will come. - The Light6 (talk) 03:06, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

Happy Birthday
Happy Birthday!! Aepokk Venset 17:33, June 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * Why thank you ^_^

Happy birthday, dude! -- 22:57, June 19, 2013 (UTC)

Happy birt*day! *FUCK - The Light6 (talk) 00:45, June 20, 2013 (UTC)

Happy birthday! 02:15, June 20, 2013 (UTC)

Useful links
Looks good! I would be all for adding it to the main page immediately. Aepokk Venset 18:21, August 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * I was actually hoping for Light's opinion on it, but he left IRC just before I completed it. He has seen the icons, though. One thing that is holding it back is that you'll notice Hussie's Tumblr link is his Tumblr avatar, whereas ours is just the Tumblr icon – this is because the wiki's Tumblr avatar is the same as the wiki logo, which I figured would be a bit confusing. So we may come up with a new Tumblr avatar first, before we add this to the main page File deleted (housekeeping)
 * I'll do my best to work on that How's this? Aepokk Venset 19:46, August 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry about leaving right before you finished, sleep was calling me. But anyhow, looks good, I say we go ahead with it. Also I do like Aepokk's Wiki blog icon. - The Light6 (talk) 10:33, August 28, 2013 (UTC)

Slight variant on Aeppok's idea (with bonus two options!): http://i759.photobucket.com/albums/xx238/SorcerorNobody/MSPAwikisocialicons--tumblr2.png http://i759.photobucket.com/albums/xx238/SorcerorNobody/MSPAwikisocialicons--tumblr2-1.png Thoughts?


 * Oh yes, even better, I think I am leaning towards the first one. - The Light6 (talk) 12:11, August 28, 2013 (UTC)
 * Those are both wonderful and I'm not sure which one I like better actually. But yeah either is fine. Aepokk Venset 14:45, August 28, 2013 (UTC)

Confirm Dreamdead Dream?
I reread the pannels and found nothing that would make my second scenario imposible, to be clear, Dirk was not normal dreaming he was dream self dreaming, the pannels leading up to the one I linked showed this. So if dream self dreaming is possible can a Dreambubble dream count as confirmation of a death? Whohoohuwhu (talk) 20:39, September 3, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, dream self dreaming is what I mean by normal dreaming, at least for Sburb players. Dirk is kind of weird because he doesn't switch which self is awake; normally, the dream self "dreams" by waking up the waking self.
 * Now, I typed out a whole giant paragraph detailing why Roxy and Dirk are special cases, why they are different from Gamzee, blah blah blah. And then deleted that and wrote a different giant paragraph. That went too, because it's really much simpler than that. Firstly, black "speech bubble". Not necessarily universally conclusive, but it generally only shows up when a player dreams who doesn't have an available other self to switch to. In Dirk's case, that's because both his selves are knocked out, rather than one being dead, but it generally holds.
 * The more useful indicator is this: if a player still has a living dream self, that self is the one you see doing stuff when they dream. Visually? Dudes in Prospit and Derse pyjamas. Gamzee isn't wearing his Prospit clothes when we see him in the Furthest Ring. He's wearing the same stuff as he wears when awake. We've only seen that happen for living players who are dreaming post-dreamdeath, whether god tier or not: HS 4748 (Jade and Feferi), HS 6826 (Jake), and all god tier players – here's one example each for HS 6641 (John) and HS 6386 (Rose), but there are plenty more.
 * Now, granted, we do not know for certain that Gamzee's dream self is dead from this, but it's by far the most logical explanation for observed evidence. We could certainly attempt to pin down the exact full list of possible scenarios for him, but doing so would cause ridiculously bloated wording, and that paragraph about the trolls' dream selves is big enough as it is.
 * The uncertainty is why I phrased it as "would appear to confirm" rather than "confirms". It's the simplest way to make it concise without stating something that might later be proved outright incorrect
 * alright fair enough, I think it's possible that his dream self might also have fake god teir garb, might not be totally likely but you are right speculating on all this would bloat the paragraph when we don't have toWhohoohuwhu (talk) 21:37, September 3, 2013 (UTC)

FI/FF
I knew it. Somehow I just knew you would use one of my images for the draft of this thing, if not the first actual one. Aepokk Venset 16:16, September 5, 2013 (UTC)

Eternity Served Cold and Clockwork
I think today I finally remembered what the heck I was thinking, even though it's still erroneous: it wasn't Clockwork, I thought Clockwork Melody was part of the song. ...I think. Aepokk Venset 01:04, November 2, 2013 (UTC)

Question time
Hey there's something I wanted to ask you and light6. It would be great if you could head over to his wall and leave your opinion. - bitterLime 15:47, November 8, 2013 (UTC)